A question came up at a recent conference that I wanted to try and answer here as well. We did a Q & A where people submitted index cards for our panel and this one read:
Have you ever seen someone come out of the lifestyle without Christ?
Believe it or not, that one question has three layers to it 
. The first layer is the “have you ever seen …” and yes, I have met people who have begun a Jewish post-gay journey or a non-religious but not pro-gay ideological post-gay journey.
I have also met Christians who kind of divorce this issue from their faith because they are more interested in the actual orientation change being the goal. Their faith in Christ is important but not heavily incorporated into the process. It’s rare, and I don’t quite understand it, but it happens. That’s my personal experience.
Now, I also know of people like Anne Heche who left Ellen Degeneres, married a man and is now getting a divorce from her husband. I have no clue why she left her lifestyle that she was leading … but she did. She is the most visible that comes to mind but that happens a lot in a culture that is increasingly more experimental (at the least) and sexually hedonistic (at the most.)
The second layer is “… come out of the lifestyle …” I think I know the generality that this statement represents but it is worth noting that while there is a very strong pro-gay ideology that runs throughout those who identify as gay or with gay culture… there are all kinds of “lifestyles” within the gay community. I was part of the bar, party and really really needs a therapist lifestyle. Some are part of the yuppie upper middle class lifestyle, some are of the artistic lifestyle, of the gay religious lifestyle, of the transgendered lifestyle … and many other variations of lifestyle. So, I know that the generality of “… come out of the lifestyle…” usually speaks to the ideological undercurrent present in those who identify as gay but the actual “lifestyle” can be very different from one gay or lesbian person to another.
And before I get yelled at for acknowledging a gay ideological undercurrent, that is not a derogatory description. It is just a matter of fact and a non-emotional description. Community means “common unity.” Ideology is one of the major catalysts for common unity and every community has an ideology. For Christians, our Christian ideology is known as a Judeo-Christian values or a Biblical worldview or The Gospel.
The third layer is “… without Christ.” I personally would probably have never started a post-gay journey without Him. It’s usually never good to play the “what if” game in hindsight (it serves no purpose and doesn’t change anything.) But I can’t imagine anything other than Christ being a “greater” love/inspiration to me than my gay identity and community. In Christ, freedom means so much more than behavioral modification or replacing patterns of thought. I recently wrote this to a friend that it was like going from a dimly lit but comfortable room and walking through a door into a wide open field of fresh air and beautiful options. In Christ I ran ran ran toward freedom and blessedly homosexuality has taken its proper place in my life. It is just one of many issues God wants to reason with, discuss and disciple me about.
So, yeah … I do know people who say they are on a post-gay journey without Christ. And according to their self-determined goals and beliefs, they are successful. But I can’t help but wish they would know the great freedom that transcends this one temporal issue. The freedom that can only be found in Jesus Christ.
About Randy Thomas
HI! My name is Trent and I am an AMAZED, blood-covered believer in Christ Jesus and I struggle constantly with codependency and other issues.
I relate the question with other forms of recovery. Can an alcoholic recover sobriety without Jesus? Yes. And they can have tremendous success with it. Sheer willpower can and does work, but it only glorifies the self. However, adding the real Higher Power to the 12 steps and having a ministry like Celebrate Recovery help to get to the deepest issues of all (taking control from God, flesh’s needs, make-me-feel-better/good-NOW) is exactly like walking through that door into a wide open space of possibility and freedom.
Thanks for letting me share. 8-]
You are welcome and thank you for expanding the look of what recovery can and does look like.
I would also add that with Christ, the empowerment is God’s Love and the covering is Grace.
Off the subject
The Exodus blog no longer recognizes me. Yet, I have posted many times. Is anyone else having trouble? It started yesterday. I put in my email address, and it says it does not recognize that either. But I have had many exodus blog email notifications sent to my email address. Just wodering what is happening here 
Thanks!
Don. I don’t understand your question because this comment posted just fine. If you are using your old Disqus or IntenseDebate logins on the blog they don’t work because I am not using them. You would have to register specifically with this blog or just do whatever it is you just did.
HI! My name is Trent and I am an AMAZED, blood-covered believer in Christ Jesus and I struggle constantly with codependency and other issues.
I relate the question with other forms of recovery. Can an alcoholic recover sobriety without Jesus? Yes. And they can have tremendous success with it. Sheer willpower can and does work, but it only glorifies the self. However, adding the real Higher Power to the 12 steps and having a ministry like Celebrate Recovery help to get to the deepest issues of all (taking control from God, flesh’s needs, make-me-feel-better/good-NOW) is exactly like walking through that door into a wide open space of possibility and freedom.
Thanks for letting me share. 8-]
You are welcome and thank you for expanding the look of what recovery can and does look like.
I would also add that with Christ, the empowerment is God’s Love and the covering is Grace.
Off the subject
The Exodus blog no longer recognizes me. Yet, I have posted many times. Is anyone else having trouble? It started yesterday. I put in my email address, and it says it does not recognize that either. But I have had many exodus blog email notifications sent to my email address. Just wodering what is happening here 
Thanks!
Don. I don’t understand your question because this comment posted just fine. If you are using your old Disqus or IntenseDebate logins on the blog they don’t work because I am not using them. You would have to register specifically with this blog or just do whatever it is you just did.
Randy,
That’s an interesting take on “the lifestyle” portion of the question. I would expand it even further and say there are many who struggle with homosexuality who never actually developed a gay lifestyle at all, but instead more of a double-minded existence where no one would much have realized they were gay beyond those with whom they interacted in that secret realm.
I suppose one could come out of the lifestyle without Jesus, perhaps even on personal moral grounds or a realization that it “just wasn’t for me.” However, I found that removing homosexuality from my life left a void that needed to be filled or I would have continued to experience an emptiness. Jesus does that better than anyone or anything . . . and permanently.
Thom
Randy,
That’s an interesting take on “the lifestyle” portion of the question. I would expand it even further and say there are many who struggle with homosexuality who never actually developed a gay lifestyle at all, but instead more of a double-minded existence where no one would much have realized they were gay beyond those with whom they interacted in that secret realm.
I suppose one could come out of the lifestyle without Jesus, perhaps even on personal moral grounds or a realization that it “just wasn’t for me.” However, I found that removing homosexuality from my life left a void that needed to be filled or I would have continued to experience an emptiness. Jesus does that better than anyone or anything . . . and permanently.
Thom
I think that in many religions, the main aim is finding yourself. In Christianity, this can only be achieved in relation with Christ, the real Man. Yet, in all cultures, looking for and finding yourself is key to separating yourself from plagues such as SSA.
I think that in many religions, the main aim is finding yourself. In Christianity, this can only be achieved in relation with Christ, the real Man. Yet, in all cultures, looking for and finding yourself is key to separating yourself from plagues such as SSA.
I’m not interested in arguing with you but to correct you on a single point: your misuse of the phrase “Judeo-Christian.”
Anyone who has studied both the Judaic Bible and the Christian NT in depth (I read both in the original language and from the earliest extant sources, having translated the entire NT from all of the earliest extant sources) understands that the Judaic Scripture is intractably contradicted–and, according to original Christian claims, superseded (supersession) and displaced (replacement theology)–by the NT.
The whole base of misojudaism (inaccurately “antisemitism”) has grown out of the “antinomianism” (anti-Torah-ism) I’ve described in the previous paragraph.
Thus, “Christian” is an intractable contradictions of “Judeo”; an oxymoron. There is a myriad of instances but, and I’m not coming back to argue it (you can come to my website–www.netzarim.co.il particularly our History Museum pages– if you think you can argue it), I’ll give one example to illustrate for those who are objective: Judeo implies Shabbat, Christian implies superseding and displacing Shabbat with Sun(god)day.
In other words, the term “Judeo-Christian” is self-contradicting and meaningless; a phrase used by Christianity to lend it the illusion of Judaic legitimacy.
Those with integrity will find a different phrase because this one is meaningless.
You cannot seperate the OT covenant from the NT covenant. Gods plan of redemption was first promised in Genesis ch 3.
I don’t want to be rude but you need to do much more research concerning the truth of Gods Word
I’m not interested in arguing with you but to correct you on a single point: your misuse of the phrase “Judeo-Christian.”
Anyone who has studied both the Judaic Bible and the Christian NT in depth (I read both in the original language and from the earliest extant sources, having translated the entire NT from all of the earliest extant sources) understands that the Judaic Scripture is intractably contradicted–and, according to original Christian claims, superseded (supersession) and displaced (replacement theology)–by the NT.
The whole base of misojudaism (inaccurately “antisemitism”) has grown out of the “antinomianism” (anti-Torah-ism) I’ve described in the previous paragraph.
Thus, “Christian” is an intractable contradictions of “Judeo”; an oxymoron. There is a myriad of instances but, and I’m not coming back to argue it (you can come to my website–www.netzarim.co.il particularly our History Museum pages– if you think you can argue it), I’ll give one example to illustrate for those who are objective: Judeo implies Shabbat, Christian implies superseding and displacing Shabbat with Sun(god)day.
In other words, the term “Judeo-Christian” is self-contradicting and meaningless; a phrase used by Christianity to lend it the illusion of Judaic legitimacy.
Those with integrity will find a different phrase because this one is meaningless.
You cannot seperate the OT covenant from the NT covenant. Gods plan of redemption was first promised in Genesis ch 3.
I don’t want to be rude but you need to do much more research concerning the truth of Gods Word
quote “I can’t help but wish they would know the great freedom that transcends this one temporal issue. The freedom that can only be found in Jesus Christ.”
juat wanted to say a resounding amen! we were none of us free before Jesus Christ rescued us, oh how glorious and matchless is His love and grace and how painful to see others struggle without this knowledge..
quote “I can’t help but wish they would know the great freedom that transcends this one temporal issue. The freedom that can only be found in Jesus Christ.”
juat wanted to say a resounding amen! we were none of us free before Jesus Christ rescued us, oh how glorious and matchless is His love and grace and how painful to see others struggle without this knowledge..
First, there is a need to define “change.” A drunkard who has stopped getting getting drunk without Christ has not changed spiritually. They are not a new creation, they have not been born again. Without Christ they are still in the same condition soberly going to hell. Likewise, A person who has subjectively changed his sexual desires from homo to hetero sexual but has not been made alive by the Holy Spirit is still in his sin, still under the law and is going straight to hell. CHANGE that matters is change in one’s relationship to God, going from a child of wrath under condemnation to an adopted child of God forgiven and free.
Erik
Journal Of A Battling Christian
First, there is a need to define “change.” A drunkard who has stopped getting getting drunk without Christ has not changed spiritually. They are not a new creation, they have not been born again. Without Christ they are still in the same condition soberly going to hell. Likewise, A person who has subjectively changed his sexual desires from homo to hetero sexual but has not been made alive by the Holy Spirit is still in his sin, still under the law and is going straight to hell. CHANGE that matters is change in one’s relationship to God, going from a child of wrath under condemnation to an adopted child of God forgiven and free.
Erik
Journal Of A Battling Christian
you can change almost anything on the outside, but the inside needs to be regenerated by the power of God. I firmly believe Christ plus nothing equals everything.
you can change almost anything on the outside, but the inside needs to be regenerated by the power of God. I firmly believe Christ plus nothing equals everything.