The religious discussion over homosexuality needs to be clear and balanced with the whole of scripture. Soundbites do not do the topic justice. Here is an example.
Cardinal Javier Lozano Barragan said that while the Church regarded homosexuality as an “insult to God”, this did not justify discrimination against gay and transsexual people.
“Transsexuals and homosexuals will never enter the kingdom of heaven and it is not me who says this, but Saint Paul,” the cardinal said, in comments reported by the Ansa news agency.
“People are not born homosexual, they become homosexual, for different reasons: education issues or because they did not develop their own identity during adolescence. It may not be their fault, but acting against nature and the dignity of the human body is an insult to God,” he said.
…
“Homosexuality is therefore a sin, but this does not justify any form of discrimination. God alone has the right to judge,” the cardinal said.
“We on earth cannot condemn, and as human beings we all have the same rights.”
First, the “insult to God” makes it sound like God is turning up his nose and rolling His eyes as He slams the door in our faces. Instead, He is grieved by our transgressions because He loves us very much. He knows the totality of our being which is much more and beyond our sin (sexual, relational, motivational, circumstance and all of the law.) Instead of taking up offense, He sent His Son to take up our cross. He wants us to know that He loves us. He wants us to know that while He is, and will always be, Holy, He Himself paid the penalty of our sin for us.
The whole of scripture shows that any person on the planet has committed a sin that would keep us out of the Kingdom of God but it also make it very clear that every single person on the planet will find common and level ground at the foot of the cross. We have all fallen short of God’s Divine Will and we all need salvation.
That’s Christianity 101
As a Christian on a post-gay adventure 
, for the first three years of my seventeen year journey (to date) I was exclusively homosexual. In a secular reduce everything down to a label situation, you could say that today I am a celibate-predominantly-heterosexual-bi-sexual-with-a-homosexual-past and once held a liberal gay worldview.
Go ahead, say that seven times fast. See why I stick to a Christian on a post-gay journey .
Back to the point, if I had passed away in the first three years of my journey, I would have entered into Heaven because the entryway to Heaven is through faith in Jesus as Lord and Savior … not whether my orientation changed along with my profession of faith. We may have the same rights and common dignity of every human soul but the kingdom of God is only obtained by faith in Christ. The focal point of salvation is not mine or any one else’s particular sin. The focal point of salvation for *every* human being is if we have submitted our sin, lives, soul, entire being, to Christ as our Lord and Savior.
I know both transsexuals and homosexuals who have come to Christ and were “… washed, justified and sanctified by the blood of the Lamb.” (which was also written by Saint Paul.) With all due respect to Cardinal Barragan, his generalized statement concerning homosexuals and transsexuals is not correctly informed with the whole of scripture.
About Randy Thomas
Great post, Randy!
Thank ya’ Brady.
For some time I’ve described our fallible relationship with God like this: When God sees us, He does not see our flesh or our failings; He sees the blood of Jesus. Those who are redeemed by His blood are redeemed by His blood. Nothing can change that. To say that a believer in the Christ Jesus is condemned for any sin is blasphemy at worst and heresy at best. To imply that God will condemn a believer suggests that Jesus’ one and only death was not enough and He must be crucified over and over. When we do fail the perfect standards of Christ, our real issue is our relationship with the best Friend in the universe. As far as God is concerned, the price has been pain in full. To suggest otherwise is a symptom of needing to be judgmental and in control of other peoples’ lives. We need to make up our collective minds- is one final atonement really enough, or will we continue to live in unbelief of the sovereignty of God and believe what He said through Jesus? This isn’t a homo/hetero issue. It is one of belief. It always will be. Lust is always lust, no matter where the fence-posts are.
very passionately and eloquently said. Thank you Trent.
Hi Randy, \celibate-predominantly-heterosexual-bi-sexual-with-a-homosexual-past and once held a liberal gay world view…\ Just wondering how long it took you to form that sentence? :) Just wondering … I’m wanting to get secular counseling training and will have to site before a panel of people and I’m going to have to answer to questions regarding my sexual orientation and my faith and how I’ve integrated the two. Can I take that sentence with it being slightly modified to best describe \me\ and my \journey\ while sitting through that panel of \Professional People\ giving an account for my behavior in the past and showing that my life is stable enough for this training? I think it would cause a tale spin among those sitting on the panel but I think it might help me communicate my position a little more if I can shorten my response .. especially if they’re going to be asking me to respond to questions concerning my sexual orientation.
Sarah … it actually came right out
. I didn’t even have to edit it except to add the dashes to make it read all connected like. 
And of course you can describe yourself however it best fits and applies. I personally don’t like describing myself in that way because it isn’t how “I” view myself (a Christian on a post-gay journey) but in conversations with non-believers or Christians that don’t “get” the post-gay journey thing … that description (after a couple passes through ::: laugh :::) makes perfect sense to them. They may not believe it but it translates in an easier way.
Let me know how your panel goes.
Perhaps for those who don’t get it, you could use, “I’m on a pre-perfection journey”.
If I said it, people would know I’m being a smart-Alec.
Trent,
Ya, and if I said it people would think I’m telling them that I think I am better then they are and more perfect then they are instead of considering the fact that we’re all on this journey of “becoming” in a sense perfect or perfected into the Image of Christ but the secular world doesn’t quite understand that concept and don’t really validate that as being truth. As specially in secular Counseling with the common belief that everyone essentially is perfect and will perfect their own healing.
I don’t know what it’s like for you but for me in Vancouver it’s not entirely politically incorrect to ask a person about their sexual orientation… in fact, it’s almost always understood that in a certain context this question will arise. And I”m always working in that kind of context and so I’m always thinking about ways to respond to that question in a way that doesn’t compromise my faith nor undermine the work being done….
I just really liked that phrase you wrote there … and I understand, I mean, I completely understand your point and I don’t like to really be in a position of having to describe myself at all.
When I have the panel interview I’ll let you know but so far I have a great referral from the Director of the program
Well spoken Randy and Trent! If we could lose our salvation, that would mean that we are responsible for maintaining it. Salavation is a gift(new birth from above, Holy Spirit as a down payment for our inheritance, a passing from spiritual death to spiritual life, Christ’s atoning work on our behalf, etc.). We did nothing to merit salvation and we can do nothing to lose it. The flesh cannot be redeemed. That part of us remains as corrupt as it always was. God could have chosen to eradicate the flesh , but He didn’t. Maybe that’s a constant reminder to us of how utterly incapable and how depraved we are without His intervention?
Don, half the time I wouldn’t be so verbose in conversation. Usually, I just look at people and ask ‘em how many times do they need me to crucify Jesus before I’m okay in their eyes.
Christ only had to be crucified once to redeem those who submit their lives to His Lordship. However, we must submit ourselves each new day.If we chronically sin without denying ourselves, without walking away from our sin with God’s grace, can we truly say we are making Jesus the Lord of our life?I would say not.Our faith is dead. Even the demons believe that Christ is God.
For me to say Jesus is my Lord and then continue to indulge in my sin seems to make a mockery of that statement of belief.
Randy, I really enjoy your thought-provoking commentaries. I attended the Exodus conference last summer and it was truly a spiritually renewing event.
But we all sin in some way each and every day, and we are not always aware of our sins. Perhaps there are some GLBT individuals who are denying other sins, such as intolerance or greed, but still give in to sexual sin, and may do so until the end of their lives. Likewise, even those of us who are walking away from homosexual behavior may have other sins in our lives that we aren’t even aware of. We are not allowed to judge the hearts of others. You said:
For me to say Jesus is my Lord and then continue to indulge in my sin seems to make a mockery of that statement of belief.
So you never indulged in sin after you first said Jesus is Lord? I think we all sin. I’ve sinned today in some way, and I’m sure you have too. God’s grace is so amazing because it’s so vast, and it covers all sins, even the ones that we are not aware of.
In theological terms there are two “classfied” sins …
1. Sins of Commission
2. Sins of Omission
There is a lot I actually agree with you on …
I really believe that the blood of Jesus poured out for our sins is just as much powerfully poured out upon the sins in our lives we have yet to recognize as sinful. Coming to believe in Jesus as Lord and Savior is only the first step. Sanctification being a 2-fold process is both instantaneous and also a process that will continue until Christ returns and we receive our glorified bodies in Christ.
I believe I was in fact a Christian before I completely surrendered everything … it was and still is a work in progress. There are some sinful behaviors that are a little less obvious but when it comes to homosexual behavior the bible is actually very clear … the word couldn’t actually get any clearer then it is.
There are a few teachings that are very strong in the scriptures …
1. Social Justice … taking care of the poor, the widow, the needy
2. Sanctity of Life … that every life is valued, pre-ordained of God, created in the Image of God.
2. Sanctity of Marriage … That we have been created as male, female, in the Image of God and with the only union blessed of God being between one man and one woman.
But again … we’re all in process aren’t we? We’re all learning, growing, and becoming devoted followers of Christ is a process like anything else.
Where my sins make a mockery of what Jesus has done for me is to take a look at what I really know to be sin and justify what I know to be sinful behavior by making grace what it is not. To live by Grace is actually to set a higher standard then to live by law… if you think about it. The law says don’t murder while grace says don’t even call him a bad name. Grace empowers while law enables us to see the gravity of our sin but grace allows us to see the gravity of our sin and then empowers us to live a life of holiness and righteousness despite our humanity. When I choose to live a life of willful sin knowing what I know today I make a mockery of what I know Jesus has done for me.
Sarah, I have to agree more with CollegeJay. We are new persons in Christ, but sin is still active. Even as believers we sometimes and for some of us most of the time do the bidding of the flesh. The flesh is not redeemable. But it is constantly there to woo us back and we succumb to it. God could have chosen to do away with the flesh at the point of our belief, but He did not. Could it be that not eradicating the flesh causes us to be humble and able to indentify with unbelievers and to love them even while they are making sinful, harmful decisions? Just a thought!
Donbeeson, I didn’t actually disagree with College Jay.
I believe it is possible to live a life free from sinful behavior. I don’t view temptation as sinful as Jesus himself faced temptations cause the scriptures tell us that He is without sin. Free from sinful behavior – yes but free from temptation – no.
The word grace in the scriptures point to an empowerment, a lifting up, it involves humility and not only sets a higher example for us today it also point tp a supernatural empowerment to walk into our full destiny in Christ while taking into consideration the whole thing called process… ie. sanctification. God is capable of walking with us out of any confusion and brokenness we face and into complete liberation and freedom from what once kept us bound.
Temptation is not bondage and struggle is not defeat. Therefore, in our temptation and struggles we can come to the cross of Jesus Christ, be lifted up, and empowered to make right choices in our lives… I do this every day of my life though I’m not perfect. Over a period of time one grows, matures, and walks away from addictive and destructive behavior as the person learns new ways of relating with others and within the circumstances they may face in life.
There is a huge difference between being in process and rebelling against God.
Being in process can allow for stumbles and it can produces humility while rebelling against God will only produce arrogance, pride and the hardening of our heart.
In light of what you’ve said, I’d love to hear your thoughts about alcoholism all the way through food addiction in the life of a genuine believer.
My thoughts on alcoholism, addiction … etc etc … in the life of a genuine believe is “sanctification” Sancitification is both an instantaneous work done by faith when we come to faith in Christ but it is also a process being worked out on a daily basis.
From my own experiences coming out of addiction, homosexuality, Transgenderism … having also witnessed my father’s journey towards sobriety as well … and also through my experience of having gone through this program called Living Waters and today being apart of their leadership I have thought a lot about this area.
I am celebate and have a weakness towards food. … I sorta need food to survive but there is a weakness to want to turn to food instead of engaging with the support of friends and also engaging with my Living Waters team to support me in my daily walking out of all of the above.
Just recently the coordinator confronted me in her perception of me withdrawing from the team … good for her ! I’m glad we had “the talk” it’s proved to be good and beneficial for me …
So .. I’m not talking about the daily learning of walking free from addictions … I am however talking about the possibility of being free’d from acting out in our addiction and sinful behavior. It is possible to not act out in sinful behavior.
Now let me ask you a question ..
Would you say that being tempted is a sin?
I would argue that it is not.
Would you say that the alcoholic is still sinning when they’re tempted to have a drink while having Christmas dinner with his/her family?
I would argue that again … they’re not acting out in sinful behavior because
they’re tempted to have a drink or two.
I quite smoking a number of years ago and will from time to time have nick-fits and will be tempted to go buy a pack of smokes. I don’t believe that the cigarrette has the control over me it once did. I have a thought, I’m tempted with it but then I make the choice to not smoke. I have yet to “act out” and sin has more to do with acting out then it does with the temptation. To sin is more to do with a choice made in the midst of temptation, struggle, and weakness.
One friend who I met at church like a decade ago became a Living Waters participate a decade ago because of his own issues with addiction and past homosexual behavior … he was the one who encouraged me to go to Living Waters but here’s a man still acting out in his addiction even 7 years after being a participant. The last time I chatted with him 4 years ago he was still acting out with his addiction but you see in his life this work being done and you know he’s not the same guy he was going into the program.
There are people who will have a very long battle getting free from addiction and will fall back into addictive behavior from time to time as they learn new ways of relating. And then there are those who have come to the place of being free from their addiction, they’re not acting out, they’re not held bound to their addictions and they’re clean and sober for a good number of years. And there are those who do come from these backgrounds and after years and years of working things through even when it comes to sinful behavior they understand their weakness in temptation and know themselves well enough to be free from acting out in sinful behavior altogether. Mind you, they’re still tempted, there is still boundaries these people have to keep because of their weaknesses and areas of struggle but just because there are areas of weakness and struggle and the existance of temptation does not mean that there is also the acting out of sinful behavior.
We still have our mortal bodies that are broken and have it’s various weaknesses but the whole message of the cross of Jesus Christ really is to become overcomers in Christ, to be conquerors, to be free in Christ and to be released from the bondages that we come with to the cross of Jesus Christ.
Sarah, I do agree with much of what you said in your latest post. I was actually having a conversation with my pastor this morning, and we were discussing the sanctification process. He brought up as an example Bobby or Billy Jack?? He works with Teen Challenge and is according to my pastor an onfire evangelist. After he trusted Christ, it took him 20 years to be rid of his drug habit. So what you are saying I agree with. Some people are healed instantly;whereas, for others it can be a very long road. I think about your friend who introduced you to Living Waters. He may be still acting out, but he is born again and as you said he is not who he was. As a believer, we can engage in some very sinful, kinky behavior, but after we have done it, there is an emptiness and a remorseful feeling. I have nonbelieving friends who take annual sex trips to foreign countries just to engage in lots of sex with lots of different women. They come back very content with no feeling of guilt or remorse. They are spiritually dead. You and I cannot do that without feeling horrible pangs of guilt and feeling that we have trampled on the grace and mercy that God has given us. Make sense?
All this discussion is tremendously fruitful, and I hope it is not now dead. Sarah, I would like to thank you for a profound analysis which has helped me a great deal to think through my own addiction. The emphasis that is placed on the process of sanctification is, I would say important. God takes possession of us as we turn to Him, but that instant belonging has to be worked at, and worked out through God’s mercy and never-failing love. We also sometimes get lost on the way and must retrace our steps carefully and patiently. There is a danger I have found in self-deception–when we think we have no sin and so call God a liar–and must be brought by God to recognise what is the true state of our soul: an experience that proves crushing, yet is filled with hope. Any way, thank you all for your wise thoughts. Geoff.