Comments on: Can Animals Be Gay? Mohler Responds to The New York Times

By: James C

James C — Thu, 15 Apr 2010 22:33:37 +0000

Mr. Thomas, I think I understand what you are saying, but can you be more specific in what you are trying to convey?

Thanks! G-d Bless!

By: Phelim McIntyre

Phelim McIntyre — Thu, 15 Apr 2010 15:23:50 +0000

Brady234 – would you consider a wife killing and eating her husband normal or a mother eating its offspring natural? These happen in nature. Did you know that when the dominant rams in moutain goats were culled the homosexual behaviour noted in younger rams disappeared. Was this reported in the press? Also, you may have come cross the name Diane Fossey – the lady who studies gorillas. Last year one of the gorillas she studied in Rwanda died. The London Times, as part of it’s obituary, mentioned that before it became the dominant male this gorilla had been seen to engage in homosexual acts but after becoming dominant was never recorded as engaging in sexual activity with males. Again, outside of this obituary this information was missing from other reports. If people read the science rather than the newspaper headlins much of this research is lacking is conclusive evidence – people need to remember that propaganda is as much what is left out as what is put in.

By: Brady234

Brady234 — Wed, 14 Apr 2010 21:34:33 +0000

Hi Catherine. In response to your statement, “What does strike me is that some people are looking to animals to define what is normal for humans,” I can say that I have been brought into this debate a time or two.

For me, it usually goes like this:

Other person (OP): Being gay is not natural!
Me: Yes it is, it happens all the time, always has.
OP: Prove it.
Me: Well, it’s been documented in hundreds of species of animals.
OP: So, just because animals do it, you think humans should do it to? Animals eat their young too!
Me: Well, you asked me if it was natural, I showed how it existed in nature. I didn’t say that’s what made it right.

So, basically what happens is that someone has drawn me into proving something is natural (of or ocurring in nature), and when I show that it is, they then accuse me of saying that just because animals do it, humans should do, which is a strawman argument. They never asked me to prove if being gay was “right” and I never tried to.

No one is saying that because animals in nature have homosexual sex and pairings, that humans should too. That’s the spin talking. But, when people claim that homosexuality doesn’t happen in nature (which certain elected officials have), or when they claim that homosexuality isn’t natural, then it’s certainly legitimate to show the err of their beliefs. And, just because someone reports on or studies gay animals doesn’t make them pro-gay or liberal (this piece talks a little about that). People study all sorts of things in nature, and reporters report on stories that people will read. Sometimes it’s just that simple.

By: Randy Thomas

Randy Thomas — Wed, 14 Apr 2010 19:58:14 +0000

Agreed. I lightly chuckled when I read this:

A woman said, “I’ve been watching rams have sex for the past 12 years.”

I have better things to do with my time!

By: Randy Thomas

Randy Thomas — Wed, 14 Apr 2010 19:55:10 +0000

James, 18 years ago I would have no clue about anything you just said . Today I understand what you mean with regard to spiritual warfare and don’t discount the need to understand, engage in and deal with our spiritual lives in an appropriate way.

At the same time, I don’t think we can get past the fact that homosexuality is primarily a relational issue fused with sexual identity and general identity complexities. We can cast out satan all you want but at some point we have to look at how we are relating to other people and what our primary identity in life is.

I would imagine we are on the same page though, agreed?

By: Catherine H

Catherine H — Wed, 14 Apr 2010 09:13:59 +0000

I haven’t read the extended article, either.

My friend Martin breeds frogs. There was a point when they hadn’t got any female frogs, and the croaking from the frog tank was the male frogs trying to mate with other male frogs. Not because they wanted to have sex with other males, but because the urge to mate was in them, but there were no females present to mate with.

There was a series on Channel 4, our ‘liberal’ (read: childish) channel who, a few years ago, did a lot of ‘documentaries’ about sex. They did one about gay animals. A woman said, “I’ve been watching rams have sex for the past 12 years.”

I have better things to do with my time!

What does strike me is that some people are looking to animals to define what is normal for humans. Some animals, fish etc eat their own babies. Soooo, is cannibalism of one’s own children OK? We are set apart as humans. We can speak with intelligent thought (which parrots can’t do). We have a soul. Animals praise God, as do trees and flowers. But we are able to create, not just reproduce, but create homes, technology, plan and do things for good or evil… we have an active choice in things – free will. We are different from the animals. We are created in the image of God, unlike animals. We are different.

By: James C

James C — Wed, 14 Apr 2010 02:46:51 +0000

I haven’t read the extended article, but we are entering the very threshold of the tribulation or the last days, and the devil is going to try, and do everything he possibly can to pull souls in his direction. He knows his power is coming to a close on earth. I think that we shouldn’t be shocked nor alarmed by things that we see in the world in this present age we live in, and in the future as well. Everything will be out of whack before the lord comes back. This is the devil’s world until the Lord comes back. The doors are fully open for the devil to manipulate the lives who are unsaved and not baptized in the Holy Spirit to do whatever he wants. Those who are in the world are under the control of Satan and they are his children. Anything can happen to the lives of the unsaved, and it’s a free for all for the devil and his demon crew to use them as puppets. That is scary! As we more forward, there will be more astounding things that will occur that will be masqueraded as the truth. The devil will take nature, and manipulate it and contort it to the point that it will seem so believable so right when in reality it will be a lie from the pits of hell. There is a war going on right now. Seek the word of G-d because it’s essential to know! Also, seek the baptism of the Holy Spirit, which is highly essential in order to survive in the last days that we are about to enter. Deception is becoming so strong as we get closer to our Messiah’s return! Put on the armor of the Lord G-d!

By: Trent Todd

Trent Todd — Tue, 13 Apr 2010 17:36:32 +0000

Having read some of Mohler’s other material on the subject, he seems very interested and focused on the redemptive and restorative aspects of God’s nature with us. Two years or so ago I actually wrote him and thanked him for his caring and honest view of the issue.